here's an email exchange I had recently from someone (adult) after a Young Life Bible study with some high school kids. I was able to clarify if only for myself some of the ideas of grace and freedom I've been having. The person who wrote the original email gave permission for this post.
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I love those verses you included there. Great stuff. Yeah- and last night was great. I'm more stoked that it got people thinking and talking than anything else. I would rather be wrong than have an impotent and safe faith. All this is somewhat new to me... not the words and the language and the teaching, but what it actually means to me and in the lives of believers. I'm glad that your house is a safe place to discuss all this because it's nuts.
I'm reading a book right now called "Scandalous Freedom" but I'm not nearly done. The author Steve Brown is a really smart seminary dude and I'm interested to see where some of his ideas go.
Call this overly radical, but I'm currently thinking that we are really and completely free. Free "from" - certainly. But also free "to" - and free + any other preposition (of, with, to, from...). I see this as a complete abandoment to the obligation of the law and a complete dependency on Christ. And I hate it because I want rules and a measuring stick. I WANT TO FEEL LIKE I AM GOOD AND DOING GOOD - therefore I want law. But that, I think, does not honor Christ. To find any righteousness apart from him is dangerous. The tricky part is if that is true, how do I rightly view the good things that I do? It's tough.
Regarding the fact that we are slaves to righteousness - EXACTLY! - how else could we have freedom? If we are not absolutely and completely righteous in Christ by HIS doing and HIS will and HIS security, then by no means are we free. We would still have to earn. The beautiful part is that none of this is about us. It is all about God if this is true. Because we are slaves to righteousness we are free! I love our slave master! So that's where I might disagree with
you a little bit - we do not and cannot choose to be slaves to righteousness. I think that is actually impossible. Because we are taken slaves to it, and only because we are taken captive and we cannot leave, there is where we can be free. We cannot escape the righteousness that Christ has secured for us! AND, therefore, it is impossible for us to live up to it - we cannot live up to it, and we should not try, because it is already completely done.
So, how do we live? I have no idea... but what I'm learning now is to live more by desire than by obligation. To replace the word "should" with "want". I want to be more disciplined, I want to know God, I want to be with kids in ministry, I want to obey. If we put the word "should" in to each of those phrases, I don't know about anyone else, but I am going to feel completely inadequate and guilty because I accomplish none of of them. But if it is an honest desire, I think
that honors God, and when we fail we can claim the fact that Christ didn't fail instead of finding ways to succeed. But, now, I WANT to (not should) find ways to "succeed" (and I define success by faithfulness and not result) and maybe when I shed the guilt and the burden that might just actually happen.
I believe this is more than just a semantic difference in how we understand these things. I believe that this strikes at the very nature of how we define grace and how we live by grace. I think it has to do with the character of God, the work of Christ, and the role of faith. I think freedom and grace are to inform every bit of how we live.
May I encourage us to read these verses slowly...
Galatians 2:15 - 3:5, 10-14, 4:1-11, 5:1-6, 16, 24-25, 6:7-10
"We who are Jews by birth and not 'Gentile sinners' know that a man is
not justified by observing the law, but by faith in Jesus Christ. So
we, too, have put our faith in Christ Jesus that we may be justified
by faith in Christ and not by observing the law, because by observing
the law no one will be justified.
"If, while we seek to be justified in Christ, it becomes evident that
we ourselves are sinners, does that mean that Christ promotes sin?
Absolutely not! If I rebuild what I destroyed, I prove that I am a
lawbreaker. For through the law I died to the law so that I might live
for God. I have been crucified with Christ and I no longer live, but
Christ lives in me. The life I live in the body, I live by faith in
the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me. I do not set
aside the grace of God, for if righteousness could be gained through
the law, Christ died for nothing!"
You foolish Galatians! Who has bewitched you? Before your very eyes
Jesus Christ was clearly portrayed as crucified. I would like to learn
just one thing from you: Did you receive the Spirit by observing the
law, or by believing what you heard? Are you so foolish? After
beginning with the Spirit, are you now trying to attain your goal by
human effort? Have you suffered so much for nothing—if it really was
for nothing? Does God give you his Spirit and work miracles among you
because you observe the law, or because you believe what you heard?
All who rely on observing the law are under a curse, for it is
written: "Cursed is everyone who does not continue to do everything
written in the Book of the Law." Clearly no one is justified before
God by the law, because, "The righteous will live by faith." The law
is not based on faith; on the contrary, "The man who does these things
will live by them." Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by
becoming a curse for us, for it is written: "Cursed is everyone who is
hung on a tree." He redeemed us in order that the blessing given to
Abraham might come to the Gentiles through Christ Jesus, so that by
faith we might receive the promise of the Spirit.
What I am saying is that as long as the heir is a child, he is no
different from a slave, although he owns the whole estate. He is
subject to guardians and trustees until the time set by his father. So
also, when we were children, we were in slavery under the basic
principles of the world. But when the time had fully come, God sent
his Son, born of a woman, born under law, to redeem those under law,
that we might receive the full rights of sons. Because you are sons,
God sent the Spirit of his Son into our hearts, the Spirit who calls
out, "Abba, Father." So you are no longer a slave, but a son; and
since you are a son, God has made you also an heir.
Formerly, when you did not know God, you were slaves to those who by
nature are not gods. But now that you know God—or rather are known by
God—how is it that you are turning back to those weak and miserable
principles? Do you wish to be enslaved by them all over again? You are
observing special days and months and seasons and years! I fear for
you, that somehow I have wasted my efforts on you.
I'm reading a book right now called "Scandalous Freedom" but I'm not nearly done. The author Steve Brown is a really smart seminary dude and I'm interested to see where some of his ideas go.
Call this overly radical, but I'm currently thinking that we are really and completely free. Free "from" - certainly. But also free "to" - and free + any other preposition (of, with, to, from...). I see this as a complete abandoment to the obligation of the law and a complete dependency on Christ. And I hate it because I want rules and a measuring stick. I WANT TO FEEL LIKE I AM GOOD AND DOING GOOD - therefore I want law. But that, I think, does not honor Christ. To find any righteousness apart from him is dangerous. The tricky part is if that is true, how do I rightly view the good things that I do? It's tough.
Regarding the fact that we are slaves to righteousness - EXACTLY! - how else could we have freedom? If we are not absolutely and completely righteous in Christ by HIS doing and HIS will and HIS security, then by no means are we free. We would still have to earn. The beautiful part is that none of this is about us. It is all about God if this is true. Because we are slaves to righteousness we are free! I love our slave master! So that's where I might disagree with
you a little bit - we do not and cannot choose to be slaves to righteousness. I think that is actually impossible. Because we are taken slaves to it, and only because we are taken captive and we cannot leave, there is where we can be free. We cannot escape the righteousness that Christ has secured for us! AND, therefore, it is impossible for us to live up to it - we cannot live up to it, and we should not try, because it is already completely done.
So, how do we live? I have no idea... but what I'm learning now is to live more by desire than by obligation. To replace the word "should" with "want". I want to be more disciplined, I want to know God, I want to be with kids in ministry, I want to obey. If we put the word "should" in to each of those phrases, I don't know about anyone else, but I am going to feel completely inadequate and guilty because I accomplish none of of them. But if it is an honest desire, I think
that honors God, and when we fail we can claim the fact that Christ didn't fail instead of finding ways to succeed. But, now, I WANT to (not should) find ways to "succeed" (and I define success by faithfulness and not result) and maybe when I shed the guilt and the burden that might just actually happen.
I believe this is more than just a semantic difference in how we understand these things. I believe that this strikes at the very nature of how we define grace and how we live by grace. I think it has to do with the character of God, the work of Christ, and the role of faith. I think freedom and grace are to inform every bit of how we live.
May I encourage us to read these verses slowly...
Galatians 2:15 - 3:5, 10-14, 4:1-11, 5:1-6, 16, 24-25, 6:7-10
"We who are Jews by birth and not 'Gentile sinners' know that a man is
not justified by observing the law, but by faith in Jesus Christ. So
we, too, have put our faith in Christ Jesus that we may be justified
by faith in Christ and not by observing the law, because by observing
the law no one will be justified.
"If, while we seek to be justified in Christ, it becomes evident that
we ourselves are sinners, does that mean that Christ promotes sin?
Absolutely not! If I rebuild what I destroyed, I prove that I am a
lawbreaker. For through the law I died to the law so that I might live
for God. I have been crucified with Christ and I no longer live, but
Christ lives in me. The life I live in the body, I live by faith in
the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me. I do not set
aside the grace of God, for if righteousness could be gained through
the law, Christ died for nothing!"
You foolish Galatians! Who has bewitched you? Before your very eyes
Jesus Christ was clearly portrayed as crucified. I would like to learn
just one thing from you: Did you receive the Spirit by observing the
law, or by believing what you heard? Are you so foolish? After
beginning with the Spirit, are you now trying to attain your goal by
human effort? Have you suffered so much for nothing—if it really was
for nothing? Does God give you his Spirit and work miracles among you
because you observe the law, or because you believe what you heard?
All who rely on observing the law are under a curse, for it is
written: "Cursed is everyone who does not continue to do everything
written in the Book of the Law." Clearly no one is justified before
God by the law, because, "The righteous will live by faith." The law
is not based on faith; on the contrary, "The man who does these things
will live by them." Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by
becoming a curse for us, for it is written: "Cursed is everyone who is
hung on a tree." He redeemed us in order that the blessing given to
Abraham might come to the Gentiles through Christ Jesus, so that by
faith we might receive the promise of the Spirit.
What I am saying is that as long as the heir is a child, he is no
different from a slave, although he owns the whole estate. He is
subject to guardians and trustees until the time set by his father. So
also, when we were children, we were in slavery under the basic
principles of the world. But when the time had fully come, God sent
his Son, born of a woman, born under law, to redeem those under law,
that we might receive the full rights of sons. Because you are sons,
God sent the Spirit of his Son into our hearts, the Spirit who calls
out, "Abba, Father." So you are no longer a slave, but a son; and
since you are a son, God has made you also an heir.
Formerly, when you did not know God, you were slaves to those who by
nature are not gods. But now that you know God—or rather are known by
God—how is it that you are turning back to those weak and miserable
principles? Do you wish to be enslaved by them all over again? You are
observing special days and months and seasons and years! I fear for
you, that somehow I have wasted my efforts on you.
It is for freedom that Christ has set us free. Stand firm, then, and
do not let yourselves be burdened again by a yoke of slavery.
Mark my words! I, Paul, tell you that if you let yourselves be
circumcised, Christ will be of no value to you at all. Again I declare
to every man who lets himself be circumcised that he is obligated to
obey the whole law. You who are trying to be justified by law have
been alienated from Christ; you have fallen away from grace. But by
faith we eagerly await through the Spirit the righteousness for which
we hope. For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision
has any value. The only thing that counts is faith expressing itself
through love.
So I say, live by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of
the sinful nature. For the sinful nature desires what is contrary to
the Spirit, and the Spirit what is contrary to the sinful nature. They
are in conflict with each other, so that you do not do what you want.
But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under law.
Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the sinful nature with
its passions and desires. Since we live by the Spirit, let us keep in
step with the Spirit.
Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows.
The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will
reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the
Spirit will reap eternal life. Let us not become weary in doing good,
for at the proper time we will reap a harvest if we do not give up.
Therefore, as we have opportunity, let us do good to all people,
especially to those who belong to the family of believers.
---
A couple highlights from that:
-Just as we are saved by grace (we tell people "it's not what you DO"), so do we live and become sanctified by GRACE. After "beginning with the Spirit" I want to acheive righteousness through my works - and this is wrong. I need to understand that no where in this process is my salvation and growth acheived though merit.
-the memory verse Gal 2:20 "I have been crucified w/ Christ and I no longer live..." is misunderstood out of context. That's why I don't like memorizing individual verses sometimes. I/We teach it to mean "You must live for Christ" - when I think it's saying more "Christ must live for you because he has died for you and has cleaved himself to you. Our standing before God cannot change because we have bee crucified with Christ - by his choosing to do so!" A dead man is free. There's nothing to live for when we have been crucified! - all our goals and desires change when we are already dead. So let's get death out of the way and start living!
-I often feel enslaved by following Christ, or at least by the expectations I feel I'm supposed to live up to as learned from other believers. This is no one's fault - we're sinners. It's funny though, that Paul says we must stand firm in these ideas of freedom, almost like he was expecting it to be controversial. Again, I WANT LAW and OBLIGATION - I WANT TO THINK I AM GOOD when I live up to it. But it really gets scary when we say I want freedom, because it says for me to be righteous it must be on account of another - I CAN'T DO IT. Freedom is not natural for us. When we lost our identity being found in God at the fall, we chose to desire law over the freedom found in having our security and identity in Christ alone.
-Lastly, AND THIS IS SOOOO COOL, when Paul writes of "falling away from Grace," he is referring to those who are trying to live be law - the ones who might look more obedient from the rest of us. WOW! Falling away from Grace means that we are not living in freedom, that we are not living by grace, that we are TRYING to be good! WOW!
I want to live by faith and live by the Spirit. I want to sow well. And I think a lot of that happens when I stop trying to be a good Christian. I really do. I'm failing even at this. And I'm finally ok with that.
With sincere love,
Brody
circumcised, Christ will be of no value to you at all. Again I declare
to every man who lets himself be circumcised that he is obligated to
obey the whole law. You who are trying to be justified by law have
been alienated from Christ; you have fallen away from grace. But by
faith we eagerly await through the Spirit the righteousness for which
we hope. For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision
has any value. The only thing that counts is faith expressing itself
through love.
So I say, live by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of
the sinful nature. For the sinful nature desires what is contrary to
the Spirit, and the Spirit what is contrary to the sinful nature. They
are in conflict with each other, so that you do not do what you want.
But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under law.
Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the sinful nature with
its passions and desires. Since we live by the Spirit, let us keep in
step with the Spirit.
Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows.
The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will
reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the
Spirit will reap eternal life. Let us not become weary in doing good,
for at the proper time we will reap a harvest if we do not give up.
Therefore, as we have opportunity, let us do good to all people,
especially to those who belong to the family of believers.
---
A couple highlights from that:
-Just as we are saved by grace (we tell people "it's not what you DO"), so do we live and become sanctified by GRACE. After "beginning with the Spirit" I want to acheive righteousness through my works - and this is wrong. I need to understand that no where in this process is my salvation and growth acheived though merit.
-the memory verse Gal 2:20 "I have been crucified w/ Christ and I no longer live..." is misunderstood out of context. That's why I don't like memorizing individual verses sometimes. I/We teach it to mean "You must live for Christ" - when I think it's saying more "Christ must live for you because he has died for you and has cleaved himself to you. Our standing before God cannot change because we have bee crucified with Christ - by his choosing to do so!" A dead man is free. There's nothing to live for when we have been crucified! - all our goals and desires change when we are already dead. So let's get death out of the way and start living!
-I often feel enslaved by following Christ, or at least by the expectations I feel I'm supposed to live up to as learned from other believers. This is no one's fault - we're sinners. It's funny though, that Paul says we must stand firm in these ideas of freedom, almost like he was expecting it to be controversial. Again, I WANT LAW and OBLIGATION - I WANT TO THINK I AM GOOD when I live up to it. But it really gets scary when we say I want freedom, because it says for me to be righteous it must be on account of another - I CAN'T DO IT. Freedom is not natural for us. When we lost our identity being found in God at the fall, we chose to desire law over the freedom found in having our security and identity in Christ alone.
-Lastly, AND THIS IS SOOOO COOL, when Paul writes of "falling away from Grace," he is referring to those who are trying to live be law - the ones who might look more obedient from the rest of us. WOW! Falling away from Grace means that we are not living in freedom, that we are not living by grace, that we are TRYING to be good! WOW!
I want to live by faith and live by the Spirit. I want to sow well. And I think a lot of that happens when I stop trying to be a good Christian. I really do. I'm failing even at this. And I'm finally ok with that.
With sincere love,
Brody
On 2/20/07, ******** <*******@comcast.net> wrote:
> Brody --
> How awesome was the banter last night! I felt so blessed to have been a
> part of a conversation where young people are truly wrestling with some of
> the deep mysteries of our faith. I woke up thinking about our conversation
> last night and was continuing to contemplate our freedom in Christ. One
> aspect that I was focusing on is instead of thinking about what we are free
> to do or not do, thinking about what we are free from. Galatians 5:1 : "It
> is for freedom that Christ has set us free. Stand firm, then, and do not let
> yourselves be burdened again by a yoke of slavery." Christ died to free us
> from the yoke of slavery to sin. We are no longer enslaved to sin if we are
> in Him. But if you read on in that Romans 6 passage I read from last night,
> you will see that though we are no longer slaves to sin, we are slaves to
> righteousness. (v. 15 - 23) So what does that mean? What does that say
> about our freedom? Are we really totally free? Yes, we have free will, but
> that free will gives us the power to choose our master -- either we choose
> to remain enslaved to sin, or we choose to be slaves to righteousness with
> Christ as our Master. Either way, we are still a slave, still not totally
> "free" in the true sense of the word. We have been bought with a price,
> therefore we are "owned". Its all a matter of whether we live up to that
> reality or not. Your thoughts on that spin???
>
> Galatians 5
> 13You, my brothers, were called to be free. But do not use your freedom to
> indulge the sinful nature; rather, serve one another in love.
>
> 1 Peter 2
> 16Live as free men, but do not use your freedom as a cover-up for evil; live
> as servants of God. 17Show proper respect to everyone: Love the brotherhood
> of believers, fear God, honor the king.
>
> 20 My old self has been crucified with Christ.It is no longer I who live,
> but Christ lives in me. So I live in this earthly body by trusting in the
> Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me. 21 I do not treat the
> grace of God as meaningless. For if keeping the law could make us right with
> God, then there was no need for Christ to die.
>
> Just some more fuel to the fire...
> Very interesting debate!
>
> --*******
>
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